Is Chembake still here, if he is could he please tell me what the difference's are with T55 french flour and some plain aus flour unbleached. (White Wings)
Normbake
G'day Norm, the 'plain flour' from supermarket shelves usually has a low protein content - approx 8% - and INHO isn't suited for bread making.
However, the French flour classification 'T55' refers to the flour ash or mineral content. I'm not an expert on French flour but I'd suggest Australian 'Bakers flour' - which has an ash content of .55 - has equivalent characteristics with a similar baking ability.
Check the supermarket (Coles Woolworths) shelves Danubian, I think you will find it hard to get a flour below 10% from them. I've tried and the lowest I can get is White Wings plain flour at 10%. Would love to get hold of some 8% flour as there are good bread recipes that call for it.
Defiance bakers flour is 11.4% and Wallaby bakers flour is 11.8%
[quote="Bill44"]
Check the supermarket (Coles Woolworths) shelves Danubian, I think you will find it hard to get a flour below 10% from them. I've tried and the lowest I can get is White Wings plain flour at 10%. Would love to get hold of some 8% flour as there are good bread recipes that call for it.
Defiance bakers flour is 11.4% and Wallaby bakers flour is 11.8%
[/quote]
G'day Bill, from my experience supermarket 'plain flour' has variable protein quantity and quality with respect to bread making. You may well be right that current protein levels have increased from the past but I stand by my earlier post that unless flour is milled as ’Bakers flour' or 'bread making flour' - which provides consistent baking ability characteristics - there's a marked degree of variability. Incidentally, I believe that sufficient protein quantity is important, but protein 'quality' is just as critical.
I went to Coles earlier today and saw a Coles organic brand 1 kg with a protein of 11.5.
Bill I've also been after a lower protein level in flour, can't find anything.
Will give this Coles organic flour a try see what happens.
Normbake
Danubian, check around for some good French recipes and you may begin to appreciate that lower protein levels have an important place in bread baking too.
Our supermarkets in Germany are full with cake flour. Ash content is 0.4 % and proteins about 9 %. The origin of these flours seems to be from rainy regions and so the quality is poor. You could find better types if you care. Type 550 here has an ash content of 0.5% and protein level of 9-10%. This is really flour you can bake bread with. Oviously a blend with French and Italian flours.
In my region it is easy to get original French and Italian flours. T55 and Tipo00. Even Semola and Semolina di grano duro is availighble. There content of proteins vary between 9% and 11,5%.
What you simply cannot find is true hard flour. You can only by an extra portion of gluten if you like...
And you can bet I blamed soft wheat for any poor baking results.
So I toyed around al lot with these several white flours, baked simultaniously with 2 batches to see the difference. And I couldn't find so much. Only the various capability of bearing water is quite clear, and the color of the more southern flours is more creamy or... indian yellow (durum).
But, without changing much hydration I can use Australian, North American, French and Italian formulas as well! And you Aussies could use French, Italian and Portugiese formulas if you like. What a luck!
[quote="Bill44"]
Danubian, check around for some good French recipes and you may begin to appreciate that lower protein levels have an important place in bread baking too.
[/quote]
Bill, most of my sourdough baking contains a high percentage of rye flours which don't possess inslouble glutenins like wheat flours do, so I'd have to defer to your experience with 'low' protein wheat flours for bread. My limited experience with 100% 'wheat' sourdough baking means I'm not aware of many of the variations you may well be. Perhaps you could post a few low protein bread formulas for me?
Replies
G'day Norm, the 'plain flour' from supermarket shelves usually has a low protein content - approx 8% - and INHO isn't suited for bread making.
However, the French flour classification 'T55' refers to the flour ash or mineral content. I'm not an expert on French flour but I'd suggest Australian 'Bakers flour' - which has an ash content of .55 - has equivalent characteristics with a similar baking ability.
Check the supermarket (Coles Woolworths) shelves Danubian, I think you will find it hard to get a flour below 10% from them. I've tried and the lowest I can get is White Wings plain flour at 10%. Would love to get hold of some 8% flour as there are good bread recipes that call for it.
Defiance bakers flour is 11.4% and Wallaby bakers flour is 11.8%
[quote="Bill44"]
Check the supermarket (Coles Woolworths) shelves Danubian, I think you will find it hard to get a flour below 10% from them. I've tried and the lowest I can get is White Wings plain flour at 10%. Would love to get hold of some 8% flour as there are good bread recipes that call for it.
Defiance bakers flour is 11.4% and Wallaby bakers flour is 11.8%
[/quote]
G'day Bill, from my experience supermarket 'plain flour' has variable protein quantity and quality with respect to bread making. You may well be right that current protein levels have increased from the past but I stand by my earlier post that unless flour is milled as ’Bakers flour' or 'bread making flour' - which provides consistent baking ability characteristics - there's a marked degree of variability. Incidentally, I believe that sufficient protein quantity is important, but protein 'quality' is just as critical.
I went to Coles earlier today and saw a Coles organic brand 1 kg with a protein of 11.5.
Bill I've also been after a lower protein level in flour, can't find anything.
Will give this Coles organic flour a try see what happens.
Normbake
Danubian, check around for some good French recipes and you may begin to appreciate that lower protein levels have an important place in bread baking too.
Our supermarkets in Germany are full with cake flour. Ash content is 0.4 % and proteins about 9 %. The origin of these flours seems to be from rainy regions and so the quality is poor. You could find better types if you care. Type 550 here has an ash content of 0.5% and protein level of 9-10%. This is really flour you can bake bread with. Oviously a blend with French and Italian flours.
In my region it is easy to get original French and Italian flours. T55 and Tipo00. Even Semola and Semolina di grano duro is availighble. There content of proteins vary between 9% and 11,5%.
What you simply cannot find is true hard flour. You can only by an extra portion of gluten if you like...
And you can bet I blamed soft wheat for any poor baking results.
So I toyed around al lot with these several white flours, baked simultaniously with 2 batches to see the difference. And I couldn't find so much. Only the various capability of bearing water is quite clear, and the color of the more southern flours is more creamy or... indian yellow (durum).
But, without changing much hydration I can use Australian, North American, French and Italian formulas as well! And you Aussies could use French, Italian and Portugiese formulas if you like. What a luck!
[quote="Bill44"]
Danubian, check around for some good French recipes and you may begin to appreciate that lower protein levels have an important place in bread baking too.
[/quote]
Bill, most of my sourdough baking contains a high percentage of rye flours which don't possess inslouble glutenins like wheat flours do, so I'd have to defer to your experience with 'low' protein wheat flours for bread. My limited experience with 100% 'wheat' sourdough baking means I'm not aware of many of the variations you may well be. Perhaps you could post a few low protein bread formulas for me?