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Dough sticking to Banneton | Sourdough Companion

Dough sticking to Banneton

Hi

 This is the first time I have posted and have a question about bannetons.  I have a cane one, which is unlined and everytime I use it the dough sticks to it and I end up with a mis-shapen loaf.  I flour it thoroughly with rye flour, but cannot understand why it sticks.

To a certain extent I can overcome this problem by lining it with oiled clingfilm, but then you lose the ridged appearance on the loaf.  Would I fare any better if I bought a plastic one?

 Thank you

 

23 comments

Hello JB,

Welcome to our world.

I agree that the ridges look funky but they don't really affect the flavour.

I use rye flour on a tea towel to line my basket/colander. 

But I have also heard others suggest using rice flour as a non-stick alternative.

When you say it is a cane  one, is it a 'proper' banneton or just a woven cane basket?  If it is the latter, it might be that the weave is too open or the strands are too small diameter which might allow the dough to flow into the gaps.

If that is the sort of thing that is happening, then a slightly lower hydration dough might help to reduce the problem.

Let us know how you go.

Farinam

 i find a mix of potato and plain flour does the trick.

Thanks.  Not sure where I can get potato flour from but will hunt some out if rice or semolina flour does not work.

For some reason, early on I used to get some sticking (not bad), but now never. I have always used rice flour.

Some people also swear by semolina.

Kym

I think the rye flour is the problem it's notoriously sticky. If you want you could use ordinary white fllour or maybe ground maize  not by the way corn flour.

You should be able to get potato flour at any health food shop or higher end grocer. I believe its used as a thickeningagent in Asian cooking- so maybe try an Indian grocer? A little goes a long way - a heaped teaspoon each of plain/potato is enough for 3 bannettons for me.

The problem with sprinkling flour of any description is that the flour falls away from the bamboo ridges.

Just spray the inside of the banneton with oil and then dust with flour. You will not have any further problems.

Ch

Colin

The instruction I had with mine was to  make a wash with flour and water, brush it onto / into the banneton and let it dry - it worked for me

I will try different flour next time.  I used rye because it works well on couche cloths.  Thanks.

I echo overboots. Somewhere on this forum I believe I picked up the tip to first coat with oil, then sprinkle with flour (the banneton). I don't have the $$ for 60 cane bannettons so (reluctantly) use the far cheaper plastic ones. I make fairly moist 35% rye loaves and if they are a little overproofed - which often happens especially in the warmer months - they stick bad. But once I started oiling before dusting with flour, 9/10 times they will come out without shredding/sticking.

 

Reducing hydration can help.

 

Another great substance is bran which also gives an interesting surface texture. It won't do anything for the sides but sprinkling it on the bottom greatly reduces sticking down there, also very helpful on a peel. I put in six at a time and sometimes those ryes are pretty sticky. But with rice flour and bran there is rarely a peel problem.

 

Thanks CaperAsh.  I must admit I do tend to use quite a wet dough which may be the problem.  I use semolina or polenta flour on my peel and baking stone and I never have a problem with the dough sticking to the peel.

 We use bannetons daily at this bakery and also import and supply most of the German cane bannetons in Australia (via the shop on this site).

Green (new) bannetons behave very differently to seasoned bannetons. Cane and plastic bannetons both work best with a built up layer of flour and water (dough) on the base and part way up the sides. This layer builds up naturally over about a dozen uses, or can be sped up from day one by spraying very lightly with water and dusting with fine flour. 

For dusting bannetons, we simply mix fine Organic white flour with Organic stoneground wholemeal flour, about 50/50. We also have access to a type of semolina, or 'sharps' from our local mill, but personallly i find it too gritty to use raw...it has the potential to irritate sensitive teeth.

Pics below show a well seasoned banneton on top of a green banneton:

New bannetons need seasoning to work best

Eventually, after about 6 - 9 months in this bakery (about 150 uses) the film of dough gets a bit thick, crackly and probably (but not always) mouldy. At this point you simply soak the banneton for a few hours in cold water, then scrub it off using a standard washing up brush. Leave the banneton in a sunny or other dry place for a day or two, then start using as normal.

Seasoned bannetons need washing when the dough layer gets to thick and crusty

 Nothing is going to stick to that!

 

I use plastic - but they certainly weren't cheap.

 

Probably less of a concern at the commercial level - but for the home baker, baking once per week say, are there any food safety issues with letting it build up like that? I rinse mine after each use then just a light spray of water and the 50/50 flour mix leads to no sticking.

 

 

Food safety was my concern too, but having read the message below, I think I will give it a go!

well, my plastic ones cost between 65 cents and $1.00 (Canadian). I haven't found any cane bannettons for much under $20.00. Maybe I haven't looked hard enough. Personally, I would much prefer them but there are other things I really should get first (like roof repairs) before I shell out hundreds for bannettons. 

There are no food safety issues in terms of the mould, due to the oven being a sterilsing chamber. If there was no oven in the process, the mould may have to be identified a declared safe, as in cheese making (i very much doubt this is a toxic mould...but have never eaten it!)

Some bakeries are HACCP certified, and the only concern that we have heard of is the possibility of a whisp of cane entering the dough. This has never happened with us but it is possible and must therefore be controlled in a HACCP environment. One big bakery in Sydney uses hair nets to line their bannetons...so the cane texture is still present (cloth reduces the corrugated effect).

Plastic bannetons do have their place. We have sold large amounts to commercial bakeries on request. The reason we don't stock them all the time is because cane bannetons simply perform better in terms of 'rising the dough'. Plastic bannetons still require a layer of dry dough to work with most sourdoughs, which generally have higher hydration. There is no advantage to being able to wash a plastic banneton in a dishwasher unless you can get away without a seasoned banneton (drier dough or lots more flour in the banneton).

Cane bannetons frequently last 20 years or more. Plastic is useful in commercial environments that are HACCP approved, particularly if lower hydration dough is used (low humidity proofing is important too!)

 

Thanks Graham, for this and your previous message.  I think that is where I am going wrong as I wash my banneton after every use and will try 50:50 flour with some semolina (I rather like the grittiness) and the hairnet idea.

[quote=Graham]

There are no food safety issues in terms of the mould, due to the oven being a sterilsing chamber. If there was no oven in the process, the mould may have to be identified a declared safe, as in cheese making (i very much doubt this is a toxic mould...but have never eaten it!)

Some bakeries are HACCP certified, and the only concern that we have heard of is the possibility of a whisp of cane entering the dough. This has never happened with us but it is possible and must therefore be controlled in a HACCP environment. One big bakery in Sydney uses hair nets to line their bannetons...so the cane texture is still present (cloth reduces the corrugated effect).

Plastic bannetons do have their place. We have sold large amounts to commercial bakeries on request. The reason we don't stock them all the time is because cane bannetons simply perform better in terms of 'rising the dough'. Plastic bannetons still require a layer of dry dough to work with most sourdoughs, which generally have higher hydration. There is no advantage to being able to wash a plastic banneton in a dishwasher unless you can get away without a seasoned banneton (drier dough or lots more flour in the banneton).

Cane bannetons frequently last 20 years or more. Plastic is useful in commercial environments that are HACCP approved, particulalry if lower hydration dough is used (low humidity proofing is important too!)

 

[/quote]

Thanks for that info - i may have to get myself some cane ones and try it out.

I just spray with cooking oil and dust with fine semolina. Potato starch and rice flour are also supposed to work, but the semolina gives a fine grainy texture which is quite nice. I have a plastic one and I found that spraying with water didn't work, as the water beads on the surface so you don't get a good even coating. Cooking spray did the trick, and I used the dusting method you use for preparing cake tins for a sponge mix - pour some in and tip the flour around inside the basket to form a coating.

I also tried keeping a layer on the banneton, but found it just flakes off whether I used water or oil initially. Spraying and dusting each time works for me and I don't have to worry about mould or insects.

This was something which eluded me, though I only tried various things over one session so it wasn't comprehensive.

I made crumpet rings from strip aluminium - quite tricky as the aluminium was fairly thick.

I tried all kinds of flours, oils, combinations, but in the end the wet crumpet batter always stuck like superglue, meaning the crumpet had to be cut out, and also it took a lot of heavy duty scrubbing to remove the baked on dough.

Perhaps that was part of the problem - I think the scrubbing removed the aluminium oxide coating which forms naturally on exposed aluminium, leaving bare, reactive aluminium which obviously had an affinity for the acidic dough. 

It would be good to try out a range of banneton techniques and other ideas at a get-together.

We have run these 'Gatherings' in the past as a way of exchanging ideas in a friendly setting.

This one was held at Milawa Factory Bakery, in Victoria, Australia. It was around the time that the mainstream baking industry were introducing an 'Artisan Baking Cup'. Our gathering turned into a fun send-up, hence the Artisan Baker Cup (interestingly, Brett Noy was at this gathering and he went on to win the industry cup shortly afterwards).

Our next gathering would be equally as casual...teaming up with a baker you don't know and making a couple of loaves, having lunch while the bread rises.. I would also encourage more home bakers to attend as we only had one attend the Milawa event.

Please let me know if you are an artisan bakery who would like to run an ABA Gathering. We will have to hold our own gathering in Tasmania (Companion Bakery, Oatlands) before too long, hopefully before the end of 2011.